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Jessopia74

Project 3 😮 400

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Even I think I am a bit crazy taking on a 3rd project, but this 400 was the one I was following for my Black coupe rear axle build, so it kind of makes a bit of sense I suppose 🤯

It was a long drive on Sunday to collect it and a van full of parts for it. 4.5hours each way 🤪 Thanks to Pete, he us definitely a nice chap. Shame he just can’t finish this, but obviously it’s my gain.

First thing To do was pull the Redtop and as I wanted to use this to dummy up the SAAB B204 and R28 gearbox. It’s very tight height wise, I might be trimming 15mm from the sub frame to just give me a little Extra clearance. This would not be needed if you fancy butchering the strengthening ribs on the bonnet.

But of coarse The Mrs. does not think this is a good use of my week off 🤣

 

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Really nice project mate. I'll be following this one 

Edited by ANDY ABBOTT
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My Missus never thinks me working on the A series is a good use of my time and she only asks "when will it be finised?" cause then you can sell it and we can spend the money one something useful!!

we had the old It's me or the car conversation a few times, but she's still here 😉

Looks like a nice little project!

Edited by 611
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Thanks chaps. Pete really has done a lot already, but I will be putting my own mark on the build in a few ways. Shell is in such great condition for 1979. Had a few bits repaired here and there, but all very minor, I am super impressed overall.

Get as much of the mechanical stuff done this week and then sending in for preparation & paint next week.

I am a little concerned about the 4link method for rear axle though, so will need to think about this and if I change it to more OEM bottom links. I know if the chassis gets such mods the new rules mean it will need to have a special MOT, but not sure if the implications thus will have in its original reg and age related exemption.

 

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Nice project, about the free clearance for the Saab engine: Saw once a Manta with 10mm spacers between the front axle mounts where the vertical bolts go through the chassis rails. The owner did use shorter springs to keep the nose down. Was not a fan of this solution, thought this could change the caster but maybe that can be fixed with other shims on the upper wishbones. 

When I am finished with the GSI ( MOT'd) and the Mercedes truck thinking to try a Commo rear axle, want to fit it like a Commo/Rekord so the arms point more straight while a "400" has arms that point in an angle. Saw that setup on those safety device Manta's and it looks more OEM. 

And the Missus: She let me do, I make some money in the garage also and she prefers the garage more than the bar of the Barracks.

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Haha Herman , I will remember to point out that it keeps me from the bars and strip clubs 🤣 but I did consider the option to do exactly what you described, however this would also promote more bump steer too, along with other geometry of the suspension. Better way is definitely to adjust the overly big subframe. When you see the Manta next to more modern cars that run a lot of power and need to control torsional forces too, it just shows how over engineered it was. It can be half the height it now with gauge of steel used. I have a Jag XJR6 x300 and the front subframe is about the same. Obviously that uses cast wishbones and bigger fulcrum bolts, but its not much ‘more’ for a car that has 3x gte power and >2x weight.

Had to do some running about today, so not much done overall. Picked up some flat bar and started to fabricate engine mountings for the SAAB lump. Got the N/S all done. Will send everything for powder coating once it gets stripped and sent to paint shop next week. Back away with work for 3weeks then, so hopefully it will be something like when I get next time off. 
 

pic 1 is tacking up, pic 2 completed fabrication.

Tomorrow is finish off N/S, fab temp gearbox Mount and then strip box/engine to start chopping the subframe. 🙈

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Mostly down to My new MIG 😁 Actually got it a while back, but something in it broke and had to go back.Support was probably best I have ever experienced though.

I am not concerned though, as I hear nothing but good stuff about Them 

 

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That’s the SAAB lump engine mounting patterns completed and for R28 gearbox. 
That’s about it for a few weeks now, but I will get it into the paint shop whilst away.

Anyone know what is oem paint code for the white manta400 colour please? 452?
 

 

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Edited by Jessopia74
Forgot to add pictures

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Nice car Jess. I would have kept the c20xe in it and made a normally aspirated 400 rep but the Saab will be quicker. Mine has the 4 link bars and went through a not no problem. I got my Saab engined manta from Peter about a year ago. He is a decent genuine guy.

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5 minutes ago, Bonga said:

Nice car Jess. I would have kept the c20xe in it and made a normally aspirated 400 rep but the Saab will be quicker. Mine has the 4 link bars and went through a not no problem. I got my Saab engined manta from Peter about a year ago. He is a decent genuine guy.

Cheers Bonnard. I did consider that, but the chassis is geared up for a bit more power than the Xe can deliver (without a considerable amount of money thrown at it). A low boost / high torque 2.3 should suit it nicely.

I also wanted the XE for the Silver coupe, although probably without the Webber’s.

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Hi Jess, my "400" is painted in Polarweiss 452. 

Grts, Herman

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1 hour ago, H-400 said:

Hi Jess, my "400" is painted in Polarweiss 452. 

Grts, Herman

As always, Herman to the rescue 🙏 thanks mate.

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Finalised the height of the engine on the mountings and have a good 20mm clearance without any modifications to bonnet. Still need to modify the subframe by a little for the sump clearance though, but this is the best option as it lines up the gearbox better.

Trial fitting.of the exhaust inverted adapter plate ( from SAS for £78).  This enables a standard SAAB manifold to be used upside down. The manifold I have trial fitted is from. 9-3, not a bad fit & still has clearance under the bonnet - but a 9000 should be better as it will sit a bit lower. All are t25 flanged, so biggest turbo without messing Would be a GT28 with 9000 manifold. Added a picture of the 9000 manifold for comparison. I have one but did not have time to dig it out and trial it today, hopefully next time I am back so can get some pictures.

As for inlet manifold choice,  The 9-5V one I have is too long and fouls the the brake master cylinder, but the std is fine. However I think the 9000 log type will be best fit, but will need the butterfly swapping ends. so a bit of TIG Alu welding will be required.

Will trial fit this next time to better show clearance.

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Edited by Jessopia74
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Jumping ahead a bit but is that turbo water cooled, as the one on my engine which is a copy of the garret isn't and there is no way of making it cooled

Some people say they don't need it but others say turbo's do or is that just certain types

 

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2 minutes ago, bris jas said:

Jumping ahead a bit but is that turbo water cooled, as the one on my engine which is a copy of the garret isn't and there is no way of making it cooled

Some people say they don't need it but others say turbo's do or is that just certain types

 

Yes the ones I have are water cooled. T25 units, the one in the picture though has a smaller compressor wheel than the others, but it’s scrap so it’s ok to use as dummy. 

Usually non water cooled are for turbo Diesels that have cooler exhaust gases. I think it is mostly to stop the oil carbonisation that would destroy the bearings/shaft.

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I chose the colour for the 400 last week and my lad was wanting to ‘see what it looked like’. So this weekend, I let him loose for his first ever paint job, in fact model build either now I think of it  - I supplied the damaged Revel 1:18 model, a can of paint and told him to use YouTube and find what he needs in the garage. He is a car fanatic, always watching some car restro program, old F1 races or looking at pics on net social media type hangouts 13years find cool.

I was going to keep it a surprise From OMOC until the 1:1 was done , but I just leave the pics as it gives a hint what the body shop will be doing to my Manta shell. 😎

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Body shop have started prepping the outside of the shell. They are tidying the 400 kits lines first, not that it is bad, but it just needs a little tweaking and rears tubbing properly stop crud getting up into seams.

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Coming on well, like your choice of wheels😂

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25 minutes ago, bris jas said:

Coming on well, like your choice of wheels😂

😂

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A couple if updates. Interior is stripped out and the body shop started to prep for the colour change. Very solid car 👍😁 but going to get them to use colour tinted Raptor ( a special stone chip paint) on the floor pans and into seams on the inside too. 

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Next bit of the puzzle is sump. Whilst I am now considering dry sump setup for the big power unit Saab 2.3L unit, I have already set on a path for solving the sump issue. 
Metal RWD sump

Saab sump flange. 
The pickup pipe is incorporated into the sump in the SAAB unit, so it will be on this conversion part too. So a bit of fabricating to do. 

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