399Road Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Hello, I was talking to a mate the other night who was looking for an Isuzu Piazza back axle for his Manta. I've recently fitted a couple of ZF lsd's and the last one I bought needed a full rebuild. I'd heard of people fitting these Piazza Lsd's and also seen Quaife, who make the Atb (Automatic Torque Biasing) differential, listing the same part numbers for an Isuzu diff and a Manta diff. This suggested that the Isuzu's standard plate type Lsd might be the same as the Manta ZF diff. Off I went to the local Isuzu main dealer, to see if anyone there remembered Piazzas from " back in the day" and ask if any parts were available for the Piazza diffs still. "Have you got a registration number or chassis number?" they asked...... I went on the Internet on an Isuzu Piazza owners club website whilst trying registration numbers from the pictures of members cars in their photo gallery on our VRM on the computer at the garage I work at, and eventually found one of these cars was still on the road and provided me with a Reg and chassis number. Back at the Isuzu dealer, This Piazza's details went into Isuzu's computer and allowed them to print me an exploded diagram. This diagram showed two different types of axle casings and said there were some Lsd'd Piazzas and some with normal "open type" diffs. One of the axle casings looked identical to a Manta one and even had the lower spring seats fitted whilst the other picture showed another axle with a front loading diff , similar to a Ford English type axle. These exploded diagrams listed the same part numbers for the front loading Lsd unit and the one that fitted into the Manta type axle casing. The actual Lsd unit looked different to my ZF, and had more plates inside than my ZF diff but I thought it was worth a try and the diff plates would be a similar size to the ZF ones that I needed. The Isuzu parts bloke picked up the phone and found out that some of the parts were still available for these Lsd's so I ordered a couple of diff plates from them, thinking they might fit into my ZF diff and " save the day ". A couple of weeks went by and Isuzu phoned up to say my parts had arrived from Japan. What turned up was a couple of square clips about 2 centimeters long, nothing like the round plates in the picture, and as I was made to pay £45 up front before they would order these "non returnable" parts I wasn't very impressed. The Isuzu parts bloke said he could try again but I'd have to pay up front again and couldn't be sure what would turn up. Instead of swearing at him and telling him where to go I turned round and walked out of the Dealership never to return again... Anyway, still going off the information from the Quaife website listing the Manta and Piazza diff as the same part number, I started looking for a used Piazza Lsd to replace my nackered ZF Lsd. I found one on Ebay that and stopped bidding about two minutes before the end of the auction as It was a bare Lsd only - not a full axle and was at £400! As I looked at the Isuzu diff in the picture I noticed it had 10 bolt holes for the Crownwheel to bolt on where as the Manta one only has 8! Good job I'd stopped bidding as it wouldn't have fitted anyway. This got me thinking and the only way I think one of these diffs might fit the Manta is if you fitted the Isuzu Lsd diff, 10 bolt Isuzu crownwheel and matching Isuzu pinion gear into your Manta casing. The information on Quaife's website must be wrong... Anyway I've now fixed my proper ZF diff and fitted it, but would be interested to know if anyone has managed to fit one of these Isuzu diffs or axles and which parts they ended up using..... Luke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 this is something in the pipeline, we have got the isuzu diff/axle, the thing that is the main difference is the half shaft spline on isuzu is different to manta. i believe that to fit the isuzu diff in to a manta you must use drive shafts also and it all goes into an a series axle due to width. (one of the reasons most isuzu axles are used on chevette/kadetts). hope this helps i will let you know when it comes around to swopping and take pics also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
399Road Posted February 5, 2011 Author Share Posted February 5, 2011 Cheers Rutts, I've saved the exploded diagram if you end up needing any part numbers from it. Have you had a look on the Piazza owners club website? There's a bit in their technical section which made me laugh, saying they'll only give information to genuine Piazza owners with a registration number as they've had a lot of chevette owners sniffing around buying up all the restoration projects, ripping the axles off and scrapping the rest! They seem to take offense to this for some reason. Anyway..... anyone know of a cheap 1800 manta for sale? as I'm wanting to red top my Mk2 escort. Ha ha Luke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 yes seen the piazza web site. cheap 1.8 in cars for sale section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantadoc Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Similar http://www.chevettes.com/oldforum/viewtopic.php?t=11377 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
399Road Posted February 6, 2011 Author Share Posted February 6, 2011 Mantadoc, That Kadett looks amazing... I like the rear diff tunnel and four link boxes, they look like something out of a several hundred thousand pound GT race car! I see he's using the full Piazza axle with the front loading type of casing and then making his own brackets. My mate Jason in Sheffield has also fitted this axle and fabricated his own Six link ( with watts linkage) for his 78 Kadett coupe. I wonder where the owner of this Orange Kadett came up with the idea of supercharging the Fiesta Zetec engine, It's definately a "one off" . Have you seen his Alloy welding on the plenum joining the charger to the chargecooler? Very impressive. From the UK reg plates it looks like there's a chance of seeing this at Billing if we're lucky. Thanks for the link...... Luke Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mantadoc Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 Mantadoc, That Kadett looks amazing... I like the rear diff tunnel and four link boxes, they look like something out of a several hundred thousand pound GT race car! I see he's using the full Piazza axle with the front loading type of casing and then making his own brackets. My mate Jason in Sheffield has also fitted this axle and fabricated his own Six link ( with watts linkage) for his 78 Kadett coupe. I wonder where the owner of this Orange Kadett came up with the idea of supercharging the Fiesta Zetec engine, It's definately a "one off" . Have you seen his Alloy welding on the plenum joining the charger to the chargecooler? Very impressive. From the UK reg plates it looks like there's a chance of seeing this at Billing if we're lucky. Thanks for the link...... Luke That chevettes forum is "frozen" I think he was testing the water on bvreaking it. If you go up one level in that forum, members cars (My wife's Kadett is in there something like 9 days to MOT oops) and go up another level you can go down into members cars discussion where there will be a thread with more detail. The www.chevettes.com current forum is elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 that is a fantastic motor/work, thanks for the link mantadoc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasonj Posted February 7, 2011 Share Posted February 7, 2011 Hello, I was talking to a mate the other night who was looking for an Isuzu Piazza back axle for his Manta. I've recently fitted a couple of ZF lsd's and the last one I bought needed a full rebuild. I'd heard of people fitting these Piazza Lsd's and also seen Quaife, who make the Atb (Automatic Torque Biasing) differential, listing the same part numbers for an Isuzu diff and a Manta diff. This suggested that the Isuzu's standard plate type Lsd might be the same as the Manta ZF diff. Off I went to the local Isuzu main dealer, to see if anyone there remembered Piazzas from " back in the day" and ask if any parts were available for the Piazza diffs still. "Have you got a registration number or chassis number?" they asked...... I went on the Internet on an Isuzu Piazza owners club website whilst trying registration numbers from the pictures of members cars in their photo gallery on our VRM on the computer at the garage I work at, and eventually found one of these cars was still on the road and provided me with a Reg and chassis number. Back at the Isuzu dealer, This Piazza's details went into Isuzu's computer and allowed them to print me an exploded diagram. This diagram showed two different types of axle casings and said there were some Lsd'd Piazzas and some with normal "open type" diffs. One of the axle casings looked identical to a Manta one and even had the lower spring seats fitted whilst the other picture showed another axle with a front loading diff , similar to a Ford English type axle. These exploded diagrams listed the same part numbers for the front loading Lsd unit and the one that fitted into the Manta type axle casing. The actual Lsd unit looked different to my ZF, and had more plates inside than my ZF diff but I thought it was worth a try and the diff plates would be a similar size to the ZF ones that I needed. The Isuzu parts bloke picked up the phone and found out that some of the parts were still available for these Lsd's so I ordered a couple of diff plates from them, thinking they might fit into my ZF diff and " save the day ". A couple of weeks went by and Isuzu phoned up to say my parts had arrived from Japan. What turned up was a couple of square clips about 2 centimeters long, nothing like the round plates in the picture, and as I was made to pay £45 up front before they would order these "non returnable" parts I wasn't very impressed. The Isuzu parts bloke said he could try again but I'd have to pay up front again and couldn't be sure what would turn up. Instead of swearing at him and telling him where to go I turned round and walked out of the Dealership never to return again... Anyway, still going off the information from the Quaife website listing the Manta and Piazza diff as the same part number, I started looking for a used Piazza Lsd to replace my nackered ZF Lsd. I found one on Ebay that and stopped bidding about two minutes before the end of the auction as It was a bare Lsd only - not a full axle and was at £400! As I looked at the Isuzu diff in the picture I noticed it had 10 bolt holes for the Crownwheel to bolt on where as the Manta one only has 8! Good job I'd stopped bidding as it wouldn't have fitted anyway. This got me thinking and the only way I think one of these diffs might fit the Manta is if you fitted the Isuzu Lsd diff, 10 bolt Isuzu crownwheel and matching Isuzu pinion gear into your Manta casing. The information on Quaife's website must be wrong... Anyway I've now fixed my proper ZF diff and fitted it, but would be interested to know if anyone has managed to fit one of these Isuzu diffs or axles and which parts they ended up using..... Luke I have both a manta LSD axle and an Isuzu Piazza LSD axle and i dont think it is possible to fit the Piazza diff into the manta casing. The reason that Quaife list the same diff for both cars is that import versions of the Piazza had the same 3 link axle as a manta, wheras the uk models with the LSD's were a totaly different 5 link affair. Quaife must have supplied a diff for an import type of axle and assumed that all piazza's were the same. If somebody wanted a good 5 link upgrade for a manta then the Piazza axle is a good cheap alternative. Good for over 300bhp with vented discs and a plate type LSD.. and about the same width. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
399Road Posted February 7, 2011 Author Share Posted February 7, 2011 Jasonj, Thanks for your reply. The exploded diagrams I have from the Isuzu dealer also show the Manta type of Piazza axle casing you are on about. The interesting bit is that it lists the LSD for both types of axle as being the same part number as each other which" suggests" they are interchangable. However, I ordered spare parts from the Part numbers on this diagram and ended up with something completely different. Do you know how many bolts hold your Piazza crownwheel to your LSD? Like I said I've sorted my own diff out now, just wondered if anyone else knew anything about these Piazza diffs. Thanks again.... Luke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Power Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Jasonj, Thanks for your reply. The exploded diagrams I have from the Isuzu dealer also show the Manta type of Piazza axle casing you are on about. The interesting bit is that it lists the LSD for both types of axle as being the same part number as each other which" suggests" they are interchangable. However, I ordered spare parts from the Part numbers on this diagram and ended up with something completely different. Do you know how many bolts hold your Piazza crownwheel to your LSD? Like I said I've sorted my own diff out now, just wondered if anyone else knew anything about these Piazza diffs. Thanks again.... Luke. yeah, I think the rear-loading 'Manta-type' diff will fit the manta, but not the front-loader.... I guess their part numbers are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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