Fisherwerke Posted June 10, 2022 Author Share Posted June 10, 2022 When you say from the green wire of the coil. Would this indicate the ignition coil itself is bad? Or as simple as a set of points? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted June 10, 2022 Share Posted June 10, 2022 would you actually have an injection car that runs points anyway ? ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted June 10, 2022 Author Share Posted June 10, 2022 Sure, My VW's run points in both carb and injection. I do not have a dislike for points like a lot of people do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted June 11, 2022 Author Share Posted June 11, 2022 Ok, So I went out tonight and I was able to get the red one to start with some fresh fuel lines, fuel filter, fuel pump. Sadly though it’ll start and run for about 5-10seconds then stall…. It does not respond to throttle input at all. It just cuts out and stalls. I must still have a fuel delivery issue of some kind Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 if it starts but only runs for a few seconds its worth checking that the pump is running once you let go of starter switch rather than just whilst turning over ? not sure how the early ones are controlled but the later l jetronic have a relay that will prime and then keep running after starting if it sees a coil tacho output. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted June 11, 2022 Author Share Posted June 11, 2022 The red car has yellow injectors so that’s the LE-Jetronic? Where can I find this relay? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Fisherwerke said: The red car has yellow injectors so that’s the LE-Jetronic? Where can I find this relay? Yes. Pump relay has also a green tacho input to run pump when engine is running, picture showing the relay. You can bridge the pump out with a coin in the fuse board to make sure it’s not a fuelling issue. Have a read if this 21 hours ago, Fisherwerke said: When you say from the green wire of the coil. Would this indicate the ignition coil itself is bad? Or as simple as a set of points? It needs the tacho signal to generate a fuel injection pulse. Think of the ECU as a pulse amplifier. It takesthe tacho pulse and reshapes it (with inputs from temp, air flow etc) to generate a pulse length for injection. If the disi is not generating a tacho pulse due to bad condenser/points then expect it to effect the injection. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted June 11, 2022 Share Posted June 11, 2022 this is correct. bridging the empty relay socket 30-87b will make the pump run but you also need to bridge to 87 as well to power up the injectors .this should then run ( if the tacho signal is present and correct) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-400 Posted June 12, 2022 Share Posted June 12, 2022 On 11/06/2022 at 06:25, Fisherwerke said: Ok, So I went out tonight and I was able to get the red one to start with some fresh fuel lines, fuel filter, fuel pump. Sadly though it’ll start and run for about 5-10seconds then stall…. It does not respond to throttle input at all. It just cuts out and stalls. I must still have a fuel delivery issue of some kind Thats the coldstart injector working as it should, activated by the time/temp sensor and the startsignal from the startengine. Means your feulpump works. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 8, 2022 Author Share Posted July 8, 2022 The 2P trick makes it run so I ordered a replacement relay. The relay did not fix the issue so now to hunt for wiring issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 if it runs and idles with the 2p trick even when you let go of key and keeps running then it does indeed sound like an issue connected with the relay.i would check for continuity between the green wire into the relay marked terminal 1 and the coil green wire .terminal 1. if you are able then the rest of this relay can be checked as follows. 30= permanent live in. 87= feed to injectors. 87b= feed to fuel pump via cabin fuse. 31= earth/ground . 15 ignition switched live. 50= ignition switch starter motor signal. 1= coil neg and tacho feeds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 8, 2022 Author Share Posted July 8, 2022 40 minutes ago, cam.in.head said: if it runs and idles with the 2p trick even when you let go of key and keeps running then it does indeed sound like an issue connected with the relay.i would check for continuity between the green wire into the relay marked terminal 1 and the coil green wire .terminal 1. if you are able then the rest of this relay can be checked as follows. 30= permanent live in. 87= feed to injectors. 87b= feed to fuel pump via cabin fuse. 31= earth/ground . 15 ignition switched live. 50= ignition switch starter motor signal. 1= coil neg and tacho feeds. It starts and stalls with the new relay. I am guessing mice may have chewed a wire somewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 8, 2022 Author Share Posted July 8, 2022 Which membership level do I buy to get access to the technical information? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 8, 2022 Author Share Posted July 8, 2022 Additional note: A friend of mine tried the 2P trick on it and said it runs. He now says it only runs for about 25 seconds with the 2P trick vs 5 seconds without. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted July 8, 2022 Share Posted July 8, 2022 just out of curiosity .try it with the 5th injector unplugged and try it with the hose to it clamped .? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealExile Posted July 9, 2022 Share Posted July 9, 2022 14 hours ago, Fisherwerke said: Which membership level do I buy to get access to the technical information? Web membership gives you access to everything I believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 11, 2022 Author Share Posted July 11, 2022 I joined the web membership. Where can I find wiring diagrams? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 20 minutes ago, Fisherwerke said: I joined the web membership. Where can I find wiring diagrams? DM me your details and I’ll post you a spare Haynes manual for the manta 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 11, 2022 Author Share Posted July 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Jessopia74 said: DM me your details and I’ll post you a spare Haynes manual for the manta Wow that would be great. Sent info Thanks 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY ABBOTT Posted July 11, 2022 Share Posted July 11, 2022 Try unplugging stuff one at a time like the Airflow meter, throttle position senor, temp sensor, etc.... see if it makes it continue run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 13, 2022 Author Share Posted July 13, 2022 Ok, so we’ve run the car 20-30 times and it’s super inconsistent. It will run for 10-20 seconds or it will run for 1 minute. Sometimes it runs perfect and sometimes it’s rough. Unplugging the 5th injector, clamping it, unplugging the temp sensor, and unplugging the air meter does nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY ABBOTT Posted July 13, 2022 Share Posted July 13, 2022 (edited) 4 hours ago, Fisherwerke said: Ok, so we’ve run the car 20-30 times and it’s super inconsistent. It will run for 10-20 seconds or it will run for 1 minute. Sometimes it runs perfect and sometimes it’s rough. Unplugging the 5th injector, clamping it, unplugging the temp sensor, and unplugging the air meter does nothing Have you tried the temp sensor from the other car ? These can cause all sorts of running issues. Also make sure the ECU plug is properly pushed into the ECU. Edited July 13, 2022 by ANDY ABBOTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 13, 2022 Author Share Posted July 13, 2022 The 2 cars are different. One is L-Jetronic the other is LE-Jetronic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherwerke Posted July 25, 2022 Author Share Posted July 25, 2022 OK so I had a day on Sunday to look things over again. Found some issues. The fuel pressure regulator had an internal leak allowing fuel to be sucked into the intake through the vacuum port. So the car would start on cold start injector and run poorly for a bit off fuel it was able to draw through the regulator. After testing multiple items we found that the fuel injectors are plugged. Working on cleaning them now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted July 25, 2022 Share Posted July 25, 2022 wow .so it was using the leak from the regulator to supply its fuel. rather than the actual injectors ! . thats a good find. you sound like you are getting somewhere now. sorting the injectors and a new regulator should see it up and running. well done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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