Kurtupsin75 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Hi all quick question or info regarding 40 twin choke carbs looking at dellorto 40f has any one done carbs on there 20s engine just need some guidance before I take a plunge in buying them. Thanks 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) Work well mate, I prefer Dellorto over Webber's too.p, however not as many people carry the jets etc for tuning, but better carb for progression and road use(drivability ) and IMO they don't go off balance as much. however very tight against the Brake Servo, Master cylinder. You can get away with a short trumpet on Dellorto . Same issue with the XE too, carbs sit about same position as the manifold for the CIH is longer. Other option is relocate the servo & master cylinder forwards to behind the headlight, and use a rod / tube. Very common on MK2 escorts. pic shows the 6 , but the carb sat next to the Servo highlights issue correctly. @ANDY ABBOTT has some pics of his on carbs that might help you too. Edited January 25, 2021 by Jessopia74 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY ABBOTT Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 I had nothing but issues with twin webbers on both of my cars. C24ne and c20xe. Went in for setup numourous times and was just nothing but hastle. Lumpy or fast idel, cutting out at junctions leaking fuel, and killing me in the cab with fumes. Also had issues with them boiling my brake fluid so had a heat shield made, boiled the fuel from the heat of the engine so exhaust was wrapped and I fitted a cold air feed all of which still didn't make it run right. I gave up and fitted throttle bodies. Theres pics of my carbs in the projects section under i240r build. Ps my carbs are for sale 🤣🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtupsin75 Posted January 25, 2021 Author Share Posted January 25, 2021 Is that the same problem for cih engine wot I'm using not red top Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonathan Pounsett Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 So Andy - are you a fan or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-400 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 hour ago, ANDY ABBOTT said: I had nothing but issues with twin webbers on both of my cars. C24ne and c20xe. @Keith: C24ne is also CIH, I had those Weber DCOE's also on my 2.4 CIH and had also issues with the heat of the exhaust. Was better after fitting a heat shield but in traffic jam the idle went up to 1500rpm's. On this side of the water we don't have that problem with the brake servo & master cilinder: Think 40mm's are a bit too tiny for a 2 liter. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtupsin75 Posted January 25, 2021 Author Share Posted January 25, 2021 More hassle then it's worth then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Kurtupsin75 said: More hassle then it's worth then If you want a Weber carb, their is a manifold for the Opel GT CIH ENGINE that uses a single DCOE carb. If it was my money, that is only option I would do, or convert to injection from a GTE ( simplistic conversion). Edited January 25, 2021 by Jessopia74 Add pic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtupsin75 Posted January 25, 2021 Author Share Posted January 25, 2021 Would prefer sidedaught bit more old skool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
611 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Fit a nice set of throttle bodies running the Omex ECU, nice and easy to fit and you wont spend your time having them tuned as mentioned above for the carbs! Had twin 45's before and was always getting them balanced! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Kurtupsin75 said: Would prefer sidedaught bit more old skool It is, just stood upright for picture, look at the flange 🙂 56 minutes ago, 611 said: Fit a nice set of throttle bodies running the Omex ECU, nice and easy to fit and you wont spend your time having them tuned as mentioned above for the carbs! Had twin 45's before and was always getting them balanced! Indeed it's the way forward with the CIH engine for sure. Jenvey do those Weber looking Bodies too, so it could look old school, but be very smart setup. 👍 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY ABBOTT Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 16 hours ago, Kurtupsin75 said: Is that the same problem for cih engine wot I'm using not red top I had them on my 2.4 cih also. 16 hours ago, Jonathan Pounsett said: So Andy - are you a fan or not. Errrm no 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 I was chatting to a mate last night who rally a MK2 escort now and then, but over the years has helped me loads with loads of bits. We got on carbs etc and something he pointed out , that us probably common knowledge already but worth pointing out. The Weber Carbs you buy in pairs need to be as close to production run the better and avoid newer Spain built ones. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtupsin75 Posted January 26, 2021 Author Share Posted January 26, 2021 Think I keep to a standard carb seems less hassle think the bonnet be up more then closed dealing with the gremlins 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 23 minutes ago, Kurtupsin75 said: Think I keep to a standard carb seems less hassle think the bonnet be up more then closed dealing with the gremlins Another option for a carb upgrade onto the std manifold is off a Ford V6 38DGAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtupsin75 Posted January 26, 2021 Author Share Posted January 26, 2021 32?36 dgev carb they say to use I'm not sure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessopia74 Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Same bolt pattern. They can have Jets changed to match. The largest is a 40mm but very rare. The 38 is relatively easy to get hold of and parts plentiful. Can be had in automatic choke variant or manual kit. Was the first carb I changed on my old 1.9 back in the 90's. Although I never had it re-jet so it black smoked a bit 😬😂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 (edited) Had a few mantas with dellorto carburettors. Never had an issue with any of them. Issue with cih is exhaust heat. Also cold air supply. All the shit about going out of balance is bollocks if you have the right linkage connecting them. mine never go out of sync ,Fit them correctly no issues. Save money not setting up carbs buy throttle bodies much better. 😂 buy ecu ,wiring loom, sensors , swirl pot , high pressure pump just a few on list. Oh yes set up on rolling road. ( same as carbs) As said above you can buy a 38 dgas jetted for a ford 2.1 pinto engine this will be your best set off point for a good 2.0 cih. Put a fast road cam in and go 2 inch on exhaust. Quick easy mods to start. Edited January 26, 2021 by rutts 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 (edited) On 25/01/2021 at 16:12, H-400 said: @Keith: C24ne is also CIH, I had those Weber DCOE's also on my 2.4 CIH and had also issues with the heat of the exhaust. Was better after fitting a heat shield but in traffic jam the idle went up to 1500rpm's. On this side of the water we don't have that problem with the brake servo & master cilinder: Think 40mm's are a bit too tiny for a 2 liter. 40s with 34mm chokes go well on a not too modified cih for road use. I use 45s with 41mm chokes on a 2.2 slightly modified. I dont have clearance problems either 😁 Edited January 26, 2021 by rutts 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cam.in.head Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 others will no doubt dissagree but theres nothing wrong with the original varijet . basic standard carb with minimal settings.if you have a good one that doesnt leak and drives fine id stick with that. its made and jetted for the car and the autochoke usually works well. many people have had and do have problems with ones that are worn out but thats true of anything. on a plus point theres no mods to declare either. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurtupsin75 Posted January 26, 2021 Author Share Posted January 26, 2021 Got two variejet carbs and new service kit might be best option Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
611 Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 1 hour ago, rutts said: Had a few mantas with dellorto carburettors. Never had an issue with any of them. Issue with cih is exhaust heat. Also cold air supply. All the shit about going out of balance is bollocks if you have the right linkage connecting them. mine never go out of sync ,Fit them correctly no issues. Save money not setting up carbs buy throttle bodies much better. 😂 buy ecu ,wiring loom, sensors , swirl pot , high pressure pump just a few on list. Oh yes set up on rolling road. ( same as carbs) As said above you can buy a 38 dgas jetted for a ford 2.1 pinto engine this will be your best set off point for a good 2.0 cih. Put a fast road cam in and go 2 inch on exhaust. Quick easy mods to start. Carbs are a nice easy and cheaper way to make the old CIH go a bit quicker and sound nice but i could never manage to get the old 2.1 to be completely smooth over the whole rev range and the guy who did them knew his stuff. The 2.4 was setup on the rolling road with the throttle bodies and is perfect right across the rev range and the guy in Northampton can dial in and tweak the setup from his place. So it is a bit more money for the setup but im happier with this setup than the carbs. Once its run in and we can travel again its back up to Northampton for a full power setup 🙂 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Not doubting throttle bodies are better if you can afford all the parts required to fit them. just unconfirming the bollocks about twin carbs keep going out of balance. You need to check balance on any kind of throttle body or multi carb setup. Did you have webers. I tried weber never got them right. That's why I use dellorto much smoother than weber. imo Carburettors can never do what injection can do for flexibility carbs are and always will be a compromise during the whole rev range until peak performance which is getting as much fuel and air at the correct ratio for the perfect explosion at correct time. As you know. All depends what you require out of your motor. Me I thought about injection using throttle bodies but it does not work for the ideas for my car. each to there own. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
611 Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 21 minutes ago, rutts said: Not doubting throttle bodies are better if you can afford all the parts required to fit them. just unconfirming the bollocks about twin carbs keep going out of balance. You need to check balance on any kind of throttle body or multi carb setup. Did you have webers. I tried weber never got them right. That's why I use dellorto much smoother than weber. imo Carburettors can never do what injection can do for flexibility carbs are and always will be a compromise during the whole rev range until peak performance which is getting as much fuel and air at the correct ratio for the perfect explosion at correct time. As you know. All depends what you require out of your motor. Me I thought about injection using throttle bodies but it does not work for the ideas for my car. each to there own. I ran 45 dellorto's and above 2000 revs they were great but struggled to get rid of a flat spot just around the 2000, dont think they were getting enough air flow at lower speed. Its only as i was building the new engine i decided to go the throttle body route. It did cost more but bought it over a period of time so never seemed as bad 🙂 I was actually surprised how easy it all was to fit. Did an in-tank pump with swirl pop so that made the setup easier and with no distributor on it the timing is much easier 🙂 The loom comes bare for the ECU so easy to hook up all the connections where you want. Just need to be able to get out and drive somewhere to enjoy it now. Tesco and back is not that exciting an exciting trip!! http://www.theopelproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/The-Opel-Project.mp4?_=1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rutts Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Pity you can't really get out with covid situation. Bet you are chomping at the bit to get out for a real test drive. Probably hitting the change over point from idle jet to main jet progression. Did you have performance dellorto or one of the prefix lettered versions. Always stayed away from the prefix ones can be difficult to jet for modified cams and ignition systems. Mine is not too bad from idle till it gets on main jets doesnt usually live under 4k when out and about. Does come in strong at 4k rpm due to cam profile and pulls to 7k but it gets a bit loud😂 One place you will definatly do ok is economy . Usually I get 10 to 15 miles to gallon with lively driving but not really a road car as such. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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